You are currently viewing SemiWiki as a guest which gives you limited access to the site. To view blog comments and experience other SemiWiki features you must be a registered member. Registration is fast, simple, and absolutely free so please, join our community today!




Results 1 to 6 of 6

Thread: Porsche and BMW Three Minute Charge

  1. #1
    Expert
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    East SF Bay Area
    Posts
    1,639
    Thumbs Up
    Received: 645
    Given: 461

    Porsche and BMW Three Minute Charge

    With Porsche and BMW developing a three minute charge time giving 60 miles of range, this will not only be a game changer in cars, but every other type of device that runs on large batteries. This makes feasible a whole range of options for any type of device or equipment that requires battery power. By making the conversion of a large portion of our devices, even large ones, to electric power will create a whole new area of demand for a broad range of semi/nanotech devices. This is but one step in major transitions in how the world is powered. The "Great Acceleration" is definitely taking hold in the much of our world going electric movement in the world economy.

    Prototype Porsche "FastCharger" will give you 100km of range in 3-minutes

    0 Not allowed!
    Last edited by Arthur Hanson; 12-13-2018 at 08:24 AM.
     

  2. #2
    Blogger Daniel Payne's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Tualatin, OR
    Posts
    3,288
    Thumbs Up
    Received: 428
    Given: 477
    It's too bad that battery charging hasn't consolidated yet, there are still too many technologies out there:

    • CCS Type 1
    • CCS Type 2 (Jaguar, VW, GM, BMW, Daimler, Ford, FCA)
    • CHAdeMO (Japan)
    • GB/T (China)
    • Tesla Supercharger

    0 Not allowed!
    Daniel Payne, EDA Consultant
    www.MarketingEDA.com
    503.806.1662

  3. #3
    Top Influencer
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    462
    Thumbs Up
    Received: 300
    Given: 2
    The 450kW Porsche/BMW FastCharger uses the CCS type 2 plug, but doubles the power capacity by using 800VDC instead of 400VDC.

    Of course what is needed is... xkcd: Standards

    0 Not allowed!
    Last edited by IanD; 12-14-2018 at 04:55 AM.
     

  4. #4
    Top Influencer
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Posts
    146
    Thumbs Up
    Received: 80
    Given: 36
    450 kW is about the size of a typical urban primary distribution circuit at aroun 11kV. It will not be just the vehicles that need updating. If you ever use Tesla superchargers you will notice they are located close to electric substations, not close to homes. And for good reasons, substations have not been sited in convenient locations for road traffic

    The typical EV user leaves home in the morning with a "full tank" and fast charging is a marginal experience. It is good to have a network of them but very few EV drivers will depend on the difference between a Tesla 150kW and a fancier 450kW. Indeed, the fast charger may be less convenient if there are fewer stalls and you need to stay in your car to queue for them. Tesla typically overbuilds relative to the site capability so you can get out of the car and do other things, even though your car may charge more slowly.

    It is more than a number. It is how it all hangs together to be practical.

    0 Not allowed!
     

  5. #5
    Top Influencer
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    462
    Thumbs Up
    Received: 300
    Given: 2
    Quote Originally Posted by Tanj View Post
    450 kW is about the size of a typical urban primary distribution circuit at aroun 11kV. It will not be just the vehicles that need updating. If you ever use Tesla superchargers you will notice they are located close to electric substations, not close to homes. And for good reasons, substations have not been sited in convenient locations for road traffic

    The typical EV user leaves home in the morning with a "full tank" and fast charging is a marginal experience. It is good to have a network of them but very few EV drivers will depend on the difference between a Tesla 150kW and a fancier 450kW. Indeed, the fast charger may be less convenient if there are fewer stalls and you need to stay in your car to queue for them. Tesla typically overbuilds relative to the site capability so you can get out of the car and do other things, even though your car may charge more slowly.

    It is more than a number. It is how it all hangs together to be practical.
    All true, but if the predictions for electric car volumes pan out the charging infrastructure to charge this many cars needs to be put in place. If it takes (say) 30 minutes to fully charge your car in a "filling station" instead of 10, three times as many charge points will be needed but the total demand on the grid will still be the same. A typical service station which now has 10 petrol pumps (say 5 minutes to fill up and pay) has a throughput of 200 cars per hour, this will need 20 x 450kW chargers (10 minutes) or 60 x 150kW chargers (30 minutes) for the same throughput, but will need a ~10MW substation either way. So the higher power chargers don't increase maximum demand on the grid, but mean that 3x fewer charge points are needed -- less expensive hardware, less space, less wasted time, money saved all round. The optimum charge rate when you account for all this could be even higher than 450kW...

    0 Not allowed!
     

  6. #6
    Top Influencer
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Posts
    146
    Thumbs Up
    Received: 80
    Given: 36
    The charging structure is your home. Like, 7 to 10kW in your garage.

    I can relate, before I had an EV I too assumed supercharging was really important. Now I realize that is just not thinking about how different they are.

    There is use for a charger structure, but it is much more an issue of diffuse access to medium rate chargers. The megastations are nice in strategic locations. But as EVs become more important you need more places to charge them. It is not an infrastructure of big stations (like gas or hydrogen). It is more a matter of having 150 stalls of 3kW at work or park and ride which you can park all day and charge you according to availability of excess solar, enough so you do not need to queue for them or have to leave your workplace to go and re-park. Or 7kW at a mall while you shop. And beefing up distribution to ordinary housing, or adding outlets in the garages of hi-rise buildings. So many other things which actually would be useful and fit much better with how EVs work.

    Companies like VW may really not understand this, since they have not built a large fleet yet. Or they may be more cynical and just aiming to capture mindshare because the vast majority of consumers still have the IC mindset and VW just wants to get the maximum message impact without caring if it is the right message.

    0 Not allowed!
    Last edited by Tanj; 12-17-2018 at 10:07 PM. Reason: forgot something important
     

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •